The Millions in Saadallah Al-Jabri Square

The big news today on regime’s media outlets was the Millions of people who marched to Saadallah Aljabri square in Aleppo to celebrate the Russian and Chinese veto and to declare, yet one more time their love and adoration of the Bashar Al-Assad. I recall that during the Al-Aasi square anti regime demonstration. Jad, on Syria Comment argued that the square can not fit 500,000 protesters. He eyeballed the area near accurately, and I supported his calculation using the free distance measuring tool on Google Earth. Two of my regime supporting friends have argued that my support of the revolution is unscientific. I have no idea how can one scientifically support the revolution. But I decided today to use a bit more advanced tools to check the Millions in Saadallah Aljabri Square in Aleppo. I started by using a public domain software called Quantum GIS (Geographic Information System). Using a plugin in the software I connected to Google WMS (Web Mapping Service), which allowed me to view Google Satellite layer and overlay it with other spatial data as well as perform measures not available except for paid Google Earth subscribers. Next was deciding on what would constitute the Pro Regime demonstration area. As I was moderately generous in the case of Hama, I was excessively so here. I decided to allow people to share space with trees, to sit on fences, and to occupy almost every single square meter in the square as well as in many of its branching streets. For wider streets I decided to go until the second major street after the square. Once the hypothesis was completed. I went on to create a polygon overlay (pretty much a digitizing process), and then to measure the area with another area measuring tool. The end result is shown below. A larger full size image can be seen when clicking on the image, and it shows that the area calculated is 2.315 hectare. A hectare is 100×100 meters square (10,000 square meters). So the square’s area is basically 23150 square meters (including greenery, trees, structures, and a lot of street space). I do not recall how many individuals we allowed the Hamwis to have in each square meter, but again, I will be generous and assume 5 people as a first guess (nearly impossible). That would yield an amazing number of 115,750 marchers for the love of Bashar.

Saadallah Al-Jabri Square in Aleppo, Syria, where on the 19th of October, 2011, regime loyalists held one more "Millionic" march. The area within the red polygon, including the tree areas in the south central part of the image is less than 2.5 hectares. That is less than 25000 square meters.

The same approach was used to calculate the place where we Americans (of all origins) like to have our Million people Marches. It is the National Mall in Washington DC. The mall presents a little challenge in digitizing as one has to digitize account for the reflection pool and for few other small water bodies. But it is doable as seen in the figure below, which shows that even with providing for a security zone for the white house (north of the ellipse park), and with much more conservative discount of tree areas than in the Aleppo case. The mall comes to a 1.037 square kilometer. A square kilometer is 100 hectare (1000m x 1000 m) making 1,000,000 square meters, which is a figure consistent with a much lower and far more realistic density of 1 person/square meter. To play the devil’s advocate recall that every time a group marches on the mall, its adversaries challenge the Million number despite of the full mall.

The National Mall in Washington, DC, where several Million person events were held and caused the mall to be packed. The area within the polygon is slightly more than 1 square kilometer, that is 100 hectares or more than 1 Million square meters.

Here is a photo showing how generous I was in estimating the area. Te green area with trees is not occupied, which takes at least a half hectare from the equation. But fine, let us be generous to those who love Bashar.


The analysis herein is very approximate.

If you find the figure of 5 persons/square meter preposterous, you are right. It is. More appropriate is 2 in crowded situations, which would make the Men7ebbaks in today’s MASEERA nearly 46,000, assuming my hypothesis is correct.

Here is a Bonus. An image was shown on Syrian TV as having been found on a captured anti-regime revolutionist. Notwithstanding the stupidity of the message the image tries to convey. It was a poorly doctored image. While such may be idle nonsense,  it speaks volumes of the regime’s manipulation, desperation, and utter arrogance. The top image, which was published on Syrian TV had a banner saying (peaceful until freedom), the independence flag has a white border around it indicating that it was added to the image. The lower panel image is the original image without the flag and the banner says “the islamic movement of the mujahideen of Iraq”


Posted on October 19, 2011, in Bashar Al-Assad, Idle Posts, Rants and tagged , , . Bookmark the permalink. 108 Comments.

  1. Deares Hamster:

    Only Hamsters inside Syria have the B**LS of STEEL to become soldiers. We are aloft the safest of trees.

    Cheers mate

  2. The tree YOU are up Husam is not that safe…
    no I won’t give you a break…as you dig your hole deeper or climb higher up that tree….

    I have no idea what you are talking about with the ‘gay’ comment, but I am pretty sure I probably don’t want to know..

    I WOULD have to change my thinking or at least behavior if – I was infringing on your life or rights. So – i take it back – go THINK what you like or about anything you want in your head…but that doesn’t give anyone an excuse to act on it or harass anyone.
    It is not THAT hard to put it in check. I sometimes feel like smacking people… (like maybe right now)…but suppression, distraction does work.

    “What can I say then, you must be real pretty 🙂 or perhaps that alley doesn’t see many women or both.”

    I have a few popular attributes….but… that’s besides the point… as Sheila says: no comment.
    I met tons of young foreign students, young women… talking about the same thing… it was the norm. And the ones who had also studied in Egypt said it was even much worse there for them.
    I stand by my demands.

    In NEW SYRIA – the men have to get over themselves and recognize a whole person there – not a body part.
    They should have to suckle some milk from every teat in the land to treat women like sisters.

  3. oops. i meant to say they SHOULDN’T have to suckle from every teat in the land… ha ha ha


    Agree 100% and would support very strong sexual harassment code

  5. I am sorry Zenobia, OTW:

    You were asking MEN to change, and speak your mind, without being hit by book. My Q: Can I ask the same thing of you – to change (and other women) without xyz? How is someone looking at you infringing on your rights? If looking or staring at women in Jeans and a T-Shirt in 112 degrees sweat is sexual harrasement you guys our of your minds.

    OTW, this is topic is not about sexual harrasment code…whatever.

  6. You obviously don’t get it. Probably because it never happened to you. But you don’t want to take a woman’s word for it – or the word of many many women, so what can I tell you.
    It is not just a tiny look. It is much more than that.
    And the sexual harassment is when on a number of occasions (similarly to others I heard from) I get followed for long periods down the street with said persons taking opportunities to whisper in your eyes. Get felt up in a crowd in the Hammidieh. Twice I was propositioned on the street. Once asked if I would take a hundred dollars to go with him and wouldn’t leave me alone until I started yelling in public.
    And most alarmingly, once followed by a car – three men got out tried to corner me near a wall. the main guy followed me again when I got away and grabbed my bag from me in order to lure me toward their car and force me into their blacked out windowed BMW. Again, i was saved by my own raised voice and a couple who were seen walking towards us. This was in broad daylight.
    A number of my female extended family members in Lebanon have spoken about prevalent date rape that goes on in their upper middle class sphere – with zero action taken by anyone afterwards.

    You should just take my word for it. I am not talking about just a flirty look across a crowded room.
    Let’s just move on now. We can worry about frying that fish when we ever get to it. right now – honor killing is still legal, is it not? or is it two years in prison maybe for that?
    so… lets not put the cart before the horse.

  7. I think that there is a concerted effort on the part of the Israeli government to influence and manipulate world opinion in general and American Jews in particular.

    C’mon Sheila, you know as well as I that both the Palestinians and the Israelis are fighting daily to influence public opinion. So what else is new?

    This effort includes the manipulation of historical facts some of which you had mentioned in your response.

    Each side has its own narrative and each side stretches history to fit their narrative. It is up to us to do the research and see how we fit in.

    Palestine was in existence before the creation of Israel.

    Yes, Palestine was consider a geographic area like Appalachia. But neither Palestine or Appalachia was ever an independent country.

    It was part of the Ottoman Empire. A simple proof can lie in the fact that Palestine was a British mandate (this means that it was geographically defined) and that Balfour’s Declaration of 1917 stated that British policy favored the establishment of a national home for the Jewish people in Palestine (also confirms a defined geographic entity).

    OK. FYI, the British Mandate lasted from 1923 to 1948. My main historical reference is “A History of Israel from the rise of Zionism to our time”, 2nd Ed., 1996 (it’s already old).

    None. You and I do not live in the Arab World. Our media here in the US avoids as much as possible talking about Israel‘s treatment of the Palestinians.

    OK, what did you see on-line? There are more media outlets than Fox News, YNet and the Jerusalem Post. Did you check al-Jazzera, Ha’aretz, IRNA, SANA? What about Palestinian news sources?

    Why do you think the US government opposed Aljazeera so much?

    Sheila, the US government doesn’t “oppose” news sources. The US government continually publicizes her stances on issues, including the those pertaining to the ME. The US usually MAKES news and almost never takes sides with news sources. Actually recently, Obama took issue with a Fox News reporter by asking the reporter why he was a Mitt Romney advocate.

    It is precisely because of its coverage of the Palestinian plight. I guarantee you, had you lived there and watched what is done to the Palestinians, you would be the first one to fight Israel.


    There are two sides to this story, not just the mistreatment and displacement of Palestinians.

    It is cruel and immoral. I have to say two things here:
    1- Not all Israelis agree with their government policies toward the Palestinians. Many are vehemently opposed to them.
    2- This has nothing to do with the fact that the Arab regimes treat the other Arabs just the same if not worse in some cases. This fact does not diminish Israel’s guilt.

    Yes, there are Israelis who have deeply varying opinions on the plight of the Palestinians. It ranges from those that believe Israel should be dismantled, to those that believe Palestine should never be a state.

    I believe these are both extremist opinions and that the solution rest somewhere in between. I am sure you believe in something similar.

    You said: “I think it is pretty clear that Arabs suffer more outside of Israel than they do in Israel”. This is a correct statement if you are talking about the Palestinian Israelis, however, try to live in the West Bank or Gaza.

    OK. So? Who controls Gaza? Who controls the PA? Who refuses to negotiate, who wants continue conflict? Gaza is an Iranian/Jihadist basket-case. The West Bank is actually looking a lot better economically. Yes, it is relative.

    There are some things that one ponders:
    1- Why is it that Jewish groups in the US who are always involved in the upholding of the separation of church and state, support a country based on religion: a Jewish state?

    Because Israel is a homeland for the Jewish People regardless of their religion. Italy is the country for the Italian People whether they are Jewish or Christian. Similarly, Israel is the state of the Jewish people whether they are Jewish, Muslim, Christian or atheist. As Wafa Sultan stated, you can’t place labels on people, you should call them by how they define themselves. Palestine should be divided into 2 states: one for the Palestinian People, and one for the Jewish People. Moreover, 1/4 of the population of Israel is muslim, and they have the same rights as Jews.

    2- With all the crimes committed against the Jews in Europe and all their suffering, why did they feel that it was not a problem to inflict some of the same pain on the Palestinians.

    Pain was inflicted on Arabs most probably in self-defense. Pain is not exacted on Israeli Arabs, who seem to not be so anti-Israel as you are.

    3- Why create this situation of hostility in the Middle East?

    The hostility was and still is, the refusal by Palestinians and other Arab states to recognize a Jewish State: a state where the Jewish People have a national home on a part of Palestine.

    Even though I am not one to believe in conspiracy theories, sometimes I feel like the Europeans supported this with the sole purpose of getting rid of their Jews once and for all.

    Sheila, believe in what you will, but as a Jew, I feel 6 million of my people could have survived if Israel was created 10 years earlier.

    You asked: “What do you propose?”. I have addressed this on SC before. I think that the only way to create peace in the ME, is for both parties to admit mistakes made and move past them.

    It will take more than admitting mistakes. It will take a final, negotiated settlement.

    You have to remember that the Palestinians were living in their homes and on their land minding their own business when the Jews decided to create Israel on top of them.

    The UN partition plan did not require any Palestinians to mover from their homes. Before major hostilities, Jews did not force Arabs out of their homes. Jews bought land, worked the land, and prospered like anyone else. It was the Arab states who “spoke for” the palestinians when they invaded in order to kick out the Jews.

    It all boils down to admitting this basic truth and moving on.

    If it brings peace, I would say anything you want. However, it is the negotiated settlement that will really put an end to this conflict.

    Most of today’s Israelis were born in Israel, are not immigrants and did not commit the “original sin“. They now have as much right to live there as the Palestinians. I think that this concept of a Jewish state was ill-conceived and dangerous for all.

    So don’t live there. The danger are states like Iran who want continued bloodshed and who will never recognize 2 states for 2 peoples.

    Israel is now giving up the West Bank and Gaza just from a demographic perspective, but it is only delaying the inevitable.

    Great. So let it play out.

    The Arabs will at one point count more in number than the Jews.

    We can play the waiting game if you want, but what happens if the game ends in our favor?

    I think they need to face the music, reconcile with the Palestinians and create a country (call it whatever they want) over the entire land of historical Palestine.

    I can’t predict the future, but right now that will not work.

    This is the logical thing it to, if one can remove this emotional attachment to creating a “Jewish” state

    It is no more emotional than the attachment of creating a Palestinian State.

    The reality is that Arabs and Jews can live together in peace. They had done it before and they can do it again

    Of course.

    P.S: I still like you.


    Dear Akbar Palace,
    Listening to Wafa Sultan is like going for a root canal.

    I know, that’s why I posted it;)

  8. you have to admit. its impressive…. crafty akbar…

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